Spider-Man picture with my caption

One thing I’ve noticed is that until the 1990’s Spider-Man had a great, almost easy to follow continuity. His history was not really messed up, or had big gaps of reboots, timeline jumps, or continuity problems.

I’ll qualify this by giving bad continuity examples. Over at DC Comics, Superman, Batman and everyone there no longer follows their history from the Golden Age. In the 1980’s the Crisis event was a company wide reboot that redid everyone’s origin. Then in the 1990’s they had things like Zero Hour, which were again reality shaping events.

The Marvel heroes had much less continuity trouble. Though their was trouble with other Marvel characters, such as Iron Man who was clearly dead. Replaced with an alternate timeline teenager. A great example of a continuity and story mess.

But Spider-Man history did not have not much trouble at all. His history from the 60’s could fit and explain a story in the 1980’s.

Then what I consider the first big Spider-Man history changing event happened. And that was the 1990’s Clone Saga. With this event, vast Spider-Man story ideas and history was rewritten and changed. Characters like Ben Reilly being on the road alive. Kaine a killer clone out there. The first Clone Saga Jackal story and what we saw was greatly changed. This result had Peter made to be the actual clone.

And after this history rewrite event, to get out of the mess they had to rewrite the history they just made.

This process and clone saga end brought back Norman Osborn, who got all the blame for the event. And a character who in my opinion meant more to the Spider-Man mythos dead than alive.

The next timeline changing event was the John Byrne Chapter One Spider-Man reboot. With the long standing Spider-Man issue numbers having a reboot back to issue one. This redid Spider-Man history, and it sort of just disappeared with no clear understanding how it was phased out.

This mysterious fade out also happened a few years ago with Spider-Man The Other. With no questions of how is it possible and did Peter really shed his skin? What happened to his wrist spikes? And how convenient after all these years he now gets movie style organic webbing, only to have it eventually disappear.

As well as J. Michael Straczynski’s “Sins Past” story. It was more of a sin to defile innocent Gwen Stacy. His story reduced Gwen into a stereotype, nothing but an easy to influence, weak willed blond and a whore to boot.

But perhaps the most recent and biggest history event was the One More Day mess which redid history. Got rid of the marriage and mind wiped the public of them knowing Peter’s identity. The blame for all this goes to the demon Joe Quasada, oops I meant to say Mephisto. Yes, that is who is at fault.

But this being comic books and all, I think the Spider marriage, what I’ll refer to as the “original timeline” Spider-Man that many grew up with is still around.

What we have now since One More Day is a Spider-Man and history from an alternate timeline. His history and what we are reading now branched off when Mephisto went back to the past and got rid of the marriage.

This does not mean that the “original timeline” Spider-Man does not exist. It merely means we are no longer reading his published adventures. We are reading the adventures of an alternate timeline Spider-Man.

It’s the whole paradox of a time travel. Such as a time traveler going back to the past to undo the event that lead him to make a time machine. How could he go back to the past and correct it? Because without that past event he would not exist as he is today.

The same with the Spider marriage, if it never existed. How could Mephisto go back and change it? It had to have existed in the first place.

And wasn’t it established in Marvel, and in possible real life theory. That if time travel does happen, what the traveler is doing is actually creating or jumping into new alternate timeline realities. He did not effect or change his timeline reality. Rather he created and jumped to a new reality. And that the whole concept of multiple realities is in fact what really happened.

And I think it’s been mentioned in a story that when Kang the Conqueror jumps in time, he’s actually creating or jumping into different realities.

As I mentioned at the start, up until the 1990’s Spider-Man had a clear history, and probably one of the best of any superhero long running series. About 40 years of easy to follow history.

Then the various rewrites, reboots and other such reality shaking events happened in the book. It’s now at a point I think of pick and choose your Spider-Man history. And if the recent few years is an indication, I would not be surprised if another reality shaking event in Spider history happens in a few years.

Looking at Spider-Man villain Venom, the general consensus is that he was created by David Michelinie and Todd McFarlane.

But I think the situation is more complex then that simple answer.

Certainly Michelinie had the idea for a new villain, and probably named the character Venom / Eddie Brock.

McFarlane had previously stated his assignment was to draw a big villain in the black Spider-Man costume. Had he known a human was under the costume, he would not have designed it that way. McFarlane made the character and suit huge and Hulk like in size. He had drawn the Hulk recently and was used to the style. He also said his Venom was hunched over, an idea most artists and fans don’t realize.

McFarlane provided the claw hands, face with teeth, and tongue. As well as designed the Eddie Brock face.

Mike Zeck designed the black costume Spider-Man, and since the Venom suit is just a modified version of this design, Zeck deserves credit for Venom as well.

The idea of the costume being a living entity, a symbiote is from a source I don’t have a reference for. Was it by Jim Shooter who wrote the Secret Wars series? Or some other writer?

Either way, back then the symbiote costume idea seemed a throw away device, and in no way imagined what it evolved into and how it influenced comics since.

The symbiote costume idea was then taken by many comic creations in the 90’s. As well as used in Spidey video games, animated series, and even in the last movie.

Erik Larsen should also be mentioned because he was the first one to exaggerate Venom’s huge jawline and tongue hanging out to a ridiculous degree. I also think I remember him mention, he really didn’t care for the Venom character at all. Either way, his exaggeration is the style most artists have used when they draw Venom with his tongue hanging out.

Overall, quite a few hands were involved in the creation of Venom and his status quo as a character.

I would say, as mentioned above, the one big quality the character provided for the comic book community was the idea of a symbiote costume. Since Venom, many other creators latched on to the idea, expanded on it, or created characters with the same basic concept.

Such as Carnage, Spawn, Wildstar, Wetworks, Toxin, Hybrid, Nightwatch, and many more.

Have you been wondering where the Spectacular Spider-Man Season 2 cartoon is?

I wasn’t able to find any of the new episodes on television.

But I did and you can watch Season 2 on the Internet. It’s a 13 episode season.

I don’t think it’s safe to say where / how you can get it. Other then to say just google it and take it from there.

A few new Spidey villains make appearances.

With Season 1 this will make for 26 episodes.

It really is a shame they don’t do more episodes a season. I mean Wolverine and the X-men had 26 episodes for their first season.

I’m not even sure if this will get picked up for a 3rd season?

It would be a shame if it’s canceled because while I originally didn’t think I would like this series, it ended up being one of my favorite Spidey animated series, and way better then the ’90’s animated series.

The characters out of the costume are really developed. When Spidey is in costume the action is always delivered and the fights very often are cleverly choreographed in terms of pace and style. It’s not just a generic fight with routine action.

Overall though we got 26 great episodes of Spider-Man in animated form. If you haven’t seen the new Spectacular Spider-Man cartoon before, it is worth checking out.

I’ve been following the recent Spider books since the One More Day / Brand New Day storyline and have a feeling of “Why should I care as a long time reader anymore?”

If they can erase the Spider marriage and all the strong emotions, connections that brought about. Why should you buy the new Brand New Day books and invest emotions with these characters and situations? When clearly the rug can be pulled out from under the reader at the whim of Marvel.

One thing that made the Spider books great was the realistic setting and actions having consequences. The Brand New Day reboot showed that consequences can be erased like they never happened.

It feels like I’m reading 1970’s era Spider-Man again. Harry Osborn (who conveniently returned) doesn’t know Peter is Spider-Man, and likes Peter but hates Spidey. Spider-Man accused of crimes he didn’t commit. Spider-Man living with the threat his secret identity might be revealed.

For me as a long time reader it all feels like a case of “been there, done that”.

The new characters they’ve surrounded Spider-Man with feel like a cast that in a few years only a handful will still be around. The rest will fall by the wayside. And again a case of “seen it before”.

And back to my main point of, the books feel hollow to me now because of the above seen it all before ideas, and why invest emotional attachment to the books now, when clearly the reset button can and will be hit in the future. And real life don’t work that way. And sure it’s only a comic world where anything can happen, but as mentioned above the Spider books were mostly real world settings and magical resets where not what this character and book was about.

Even though I have the Steve Ditko original Spider-Man saga complete in the Omnibus last year.

I browsed the new softcover Masterwork edition made by Marvel with a retail of $25 and it contains the first 10 issues, only to see a freaking surprise in the back@ And Arrghh it’s not in the Omnibus because this recent find last year was discovered after the Spider-Man Omnibus was made.

But in April of 2008 the Library of Congress received by anonymous donation. The first COMPLETE 11 page Spider-Man story from Amazing Fantasy #15. Were talking the original one of a kind art boards here!

And even more rare is the fact that it is the complete story. Not just a page.

There is no cover though.

But the mere fact of a find like this is huge. Whoever donated it must be financially well off, because as you might know a find like this could bring you a fortune. And I’m guessing and would not be surprised over a MILLION easy. And that’s not a joke. I would not even be surprised if it hit a two million range.

The article with the piece states when contacted Ditko had no interest in it. And Lee would not be seeing the art display. But for fans this is huge.

Among the surprises from looking at the reprinted pages is that of page one in particular.

The Spider-Man image on the top right corner originally had a spider’s web all around him. It was whited out though, but the leftover lines show through. It looked much cooler seeing those original web lines. Why it was removed, I got no idea. My guess is probably editorial fearing the comic review board had it removed for looking too creepy. (And yes the review board actually did censor or had art changed because of what are now minor things like how the gun smoke vapors looked.) But this just my guess.

Also the Spider-Man logo on page one was a paste up. Which is a logo made and literally cut and pasted on the board. The original logo underneath it said Spiderman with no hypen.

Lee add the hypen cause it looked to much like Superman without it he thought. And up to issue 3 or so it was almost always printed as Spiderman without the hypen in the original stories. And really hypen just makes it what it is today and looks cool right.

Anyway the original Spiderman logo on the art board was actually drawn really fancy and had web lines all over the text. Not like the text plain Spider-Man logo that was pasted on.

All these little extras almost make me want to get the paperback just for the extras! Ugghhh too bad it wasn’t found earlier for the Omnibus.

I’d like to start by saying sure their have been exceptions, and some great Spider-Man comics, and mini-series as a whole.

But in general and the overall look of things, I don’t think Spider-Man books have been good for many years now.

I think for me, the start was “Maximum Carnage”, back in the early 90’s. This story was one big fight, with very little real content.

Around then we had the fake Peter Parker’s parents horrible storyline idea. If they were real, it would have been too origin changing for his status as a character.

Soon after we got the whole Clone Saga, and Ben Reilly Spidey as the “real deal” concept.

Which led to Peter Parker returning, and the terrible idea of bringing Norman Osborn back.
Now it seems Gwen’s killer has escaped justice.

Soon after we got John Byrne who gave us the horrible Chapter One idea, and the equally terrible issue numbers reboot. Plus throw in Howard Mackie writing in their as well.

We eventually got JMS on Spider-Man. And the truth is, I never liked Straczynski’s run or his take on the character. We got his story of the Green Goblin defiling Gwen. The terrible concept of Gwen having kids with Osborn. Originally Peter in the JMS idea. Like this would have been a good idea? It should have been nixed by the editor on the spot.

We got the terrible magic induced stories JMS kept using in Spidey, like that totem garbage. Here is a hint, magic is not a good fit for the Spidey series, it never has been.

Now we got perhaps the ultimate terrible idea of the One More Day / Brand New Day. Which was nothing less then a reboot, and the book to me reads like it’s out of the 1970’s storyline ideas.

We have Harry Osborn back and in his 70’s role of hating Spider-Man. Peter back with Aunt May. His identity hidden from all, and his marriage wiped out. And thus rewriting history as we know it, because you cannot change one thread of history, without changing all events thereafter.

If you’ve read this far, perhaps you get what I’m trying to say.

Overall I just don’t think Spider-Man books have been good since the early 90’s.

Sure their have been great issues, and mini-series as I stated. But as a general whole? It’s been one bad idea after another. And that is a shame.

Plus in the books now with the reboot, why should you care? They’ve played with the whole his identity may be exposed card. Yet it’s already been played just recently and we know that won’t happen.

We got Peter’s tension with Harry about Spidey. But we’ve seen this all before.

We got Peter’s romantic life, but we know it will never lead to marriage, or that topic ever restored.

Basically we have books now, that to me read like, been their, done that and more importantly why should the reader care anymore? Cause as One More Day proves, Marvel can pull the rug out from under you whenever they wish. Continuity really does not matter anymore. And it really is the illusion of change at Marvel, but nothing really ever progresses. At least not anymore.

I was thinking on Venom and originally he was supposed to be the anti-Spider-Man, and one of his top villains. Because in a way he was the dark side of Spider-Man. A villain who was not responsible or cared for others, he only cared for his own needs.

Later on Carnage comes along and has a similar symbiote costume. I think right there, having another symbiote by default diluted the Venom concept.

Then to make him a killer already, before he got the symbiote, and making this version even stronger then Venom and Spider-Man, as shown in past comics.

I think overall Carnage, took over and replaced Venom as a top Spider-Man villain. And if anything it diluted the Venom concept.

At least other symbiotes that were made did not last. Remember the 6 villains version, Hybrid or even Toxin? All further imitations on the same basic concept.

Comic book history can be funny, not in the laugh out loud funny. But in the: That’s pathetic storytelling writing.

Way back in Amazing Spider-Man #400 Aunt May told Peter she knew he was Spider-Man. And that she’d have been a fool not to have figured it out.

But then she died. Only to return, because the one who died was another woman completely, who only looked like Aunt May. And Norman Osborn hired this actress and gave her the information about Peter being Spider-Man.

(Read that last paragraph again. I’m not joking. That’s how it was explained away.) And YES the obvious question is: What kind of fool would not know his own family members and could be tricked like that.

A case of Pure Stupid writing. No other way around it. To explain away Aunt May dying and her knowing Peter’s identity.

Then in Amazing Spider-Man (volume 2) #35, #38 Aunt May discovers Peter unconscious all bloody from a battle, in his Spider-Man costume. And learned once again Peter was Spider-Man.
So what happens?

She gets shot, almost dies and thanks to the help of the Devil as in Marvel’s version with Mephisto, she gets better. And forgets Peter Parker is Spider-Man again.

So as it stands currently, Aunt May does not know Peter Parker is Spider-Man.

Even though it’s been shown twice, she can handle the truth.

And once again the “magic reset button” is hit. Characters return to status quo, and cannot grow. While we witness more examples of the comic book mantra of “the illusion of change”.

Where what seems permanent and real, can be in the next issue be wiped out and made undone, with no consequences and things returning to a state of decades ago.

Example like this show in a bad way, storytelling that is not funny, but rather pathetic.

I was scanning my comics and came across the 90’s Spider-Man Clone Saga. You know the one with the Scarlet Spider / Ben Reilly who replaces Peter. The killer clone Kaine, Scrier, Judas Traveller and all the rest.

Looking back, I wonder if you think this was a good moment for Spidey history?

I know back then, I was angry and pissed off. Even worried the Peter we knew would be a clone. Since those were the story hints, and it came true.

And this guy we just met, turns out to be the real Peter Parker. I admit it was frustrating times then.

But looking back on it now, I have no emotional ties to that series.

I thought there were a ton of plot holes, and things left unexplained. And perhaps, it’s best left that way. No reason to bring it up again.

And I never liked the idea of Norman Osborn returning. It also cheapened the whole Gwen Stacy storyline to do this. Yet, if that’s what was needed to get rid of Ben Reilly, then that’s what had to happen.

(And speaking of plot holes, I’ll just mention one. And not the list I jotted down a long while ago that I have somewhere.

But if Norman Osborn has a healing factor that repaired his heart. Why can’t it repair his skin and he has a huge scar? That whole thing of having a scar does not add up.)

Overall, I didn’t like the clone saga because Peter should not have a brother / clone running around their. It changes the dynamic of the book too much, knowing there is another Peter out there. And another guy with the same powers as him and doing basically the same hero work. I guess the word I’m looking for is diluted. And that’s what having a clone out there does for Peter. And worse is that in terms of his social life, this brother / clone changes his whole family situation.

And the thought of a clone who kills people with Peter’s DNA, that of Kaine is not a good thing. If he didn’t have Peter’s DNA, I could like Kaine. But on that principal alone, I did not like him.

When all is said though, outside of MC2 and Spider-Girl which doesn’t count in terms of mainstream continuity. All elements, characters, villains have been swept under the rug and forgotten.

Maybe I should be upset,but I’m actually okay with that. And for those clone saga fans, don’t worry. I’m sure some writer years from now will dig up these characters and use them again.

Every era of Spidey books introduces a bunch of new characters, usually villains. But only a rare few have sticking power and last. The rest are forgotten or barely heard from again. Ever notice that?

It makes me think on a new topic of: Why do some Spidey villains go on to greatness and become members of Spidey’s villain gallery. While others, popular for a time, just fade out. Make rare if any appearances, and are forgotten. And can not be considered part of Spidey’s rogues gallery, cause they never really lasted.

Hi All,

It was Free Comic Book Day at your local comic book shop, so I hope you went and picked up some good stuff. Among Spidey fare we had Marvel Adventures. It seems kind of weird seeing Spidey / Iron Man / Hulk on the cover as a sort of team it looks like. And looking at Marvel Adventures covers, I thing this trio would make for a good team book. Am I the only one thinking this?

Though written for a younger audience perhaps, I thought this was a good showing by Marvel with some great art and story. And hey it’s free, so I hope you got it.